极速赛车168官网 Comments on: Arguing from Authority https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/ A Digital Areopagus // Reason. Faith. Dialogue. Sat, 10 May 2014 01:33:00 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.7.1 极速赛车168官网 By: George https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-51121 Sat, 10 May 2014 01:33:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-51121 In reply to Raphael.

what do the theologians know? that's pretty much it.

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极速赛车168官网 By: Raphael https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46320 Sun, 02 Mar 2014 16:21:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46320 In reply to Sqrat.

Thanks, but I choose not to go off-topic.

Are there experts in atheism?

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极速赛车168官网 By: Noah Luck https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46311 Sun, 02 Mar 2014 05:14:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46311

In other words, do not let the anti-authority of the speaker move you, but consider what is said, not who says it.

I'm glad to hear this bell struck again. What are missing are notes that show understanding of why the problem occurs and how to practically achieve the goal. I'll quote a unusually excellent series of blog posts that strives to do exactly that. Early on it gives a good starting point of what's wrong:

"Arguments are soldiers. Once you know which side you're on, you must support all arguments of that side, and attack all arguments that appear to favor the enemy side; otherwise it's like stabbing your soldiers in the back."

So the first step in fixing the problem is to refuse to view the argument as conflict. We don't need to support all arguments that go our way or oppose all arguments that go the other way.

Instead, view debate and discussion as cooperation. We're trying to scale a cliff to the truth, so you bring your pitons of evidence and I'll bring mine, and we'll combine them to try to make a route upward that anyone with the right experience can follow. And of course we'll examine the pitons carefully for defects in their construction or unsuitability for the hardness of the rock and throw out any we aren't sure we can rely on. If we keep our curiosity and go exploring, we may find some anti-authorities have build routes to lead us to some fascinating places!

There's actually a lot of great ideas from neuroscience, psychology, decision theory, and epistemology in that linked list of blog posts. The main thing I like about it is that it's very accessible; you'll physically feel the important bits enlightening you, even while you itch to argue with the author about his personal conclusions. :D

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极速赛车168官网 By: David Nickol https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46306 Sun, 02 Mar 2014 00:05:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46306 In reply to Brian Green Adams.

When I took an introductory course in ethics in college, the first thing the professor told us (and I am sure this happens in every introductory course on ethics) was that we weren't going to learn to tell right from wrong. We were going to learn the various philosophical approaches that philosophers had proposed over the ages for telling right from wrong. This is what I would expect someone with a degree in moral philosophy or ethics to have "expertise" in—e.g., someone with an advanced degree should be able to define normative ethics vs. descriptive ethics, deontology vs. utilitarianism, and so on. They should be able to tell you what Kant's Categorical Imperative is. In other words, they should have an overview (even if they are Catholic and themselves, because of their faith, believe that the Church is the definitive authority of what is right and wrong) of moral philosophy from the Greeks to the present. They would not be experts in telling you what you ought to do in a particular situation. Rather, they would be knowledgeable about all the various different (and possibly conflicting) theories that have been put forward by philosophers over the centuries about theories of right and wrong.

If you really need to know what to do in a specific situation, you must write to The Ethicist at the New York Times. :P

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极速赛车168官网 By: Brian Green Adams https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46298 Sat, 01 Mar 2014 15:40:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46298 There is a lot of discussion here about what makes someone an expert in a given field. But we should keep in mind that just because it is possible to receive high level degrees in a field does not mean that it is reasonable to defer to such persons' expertise in that field.

It might be of some use to consider how courts of law rely on expert evidence, Courts cannot defer to any experts on legal issues (the judges themselves are the experts in to field and must make the legal decisions themselves), but they do recognize that in some areas they do not possess the necessary skills, experience and knowledge to make certain findings of fact.

Take the example of a person claiming damages for a destruction of cabinet they claim to be a 16th century antique, whereas the defendant admits to destroying it but claims it was a worthless replica. It is reasonable for the court to defer to the expertise of persons with the knowledge in antiques to rule on the age of the piece These experts may be able to explain why they reach their conclusions, and there may be competing experts. But it is reasonable for the judge to defer to the experts on these questions, and there are ways to judge which expert it is more reasonable to defer to.

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极速赛车168官网 By: Brian Green Adams https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46297 Sat, 01 Mar 2014 15:16:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46297 In reply to Brandon Vogt.

Again, I would not defer to any authority on morality, why would I? A degree in moral theology is still a theology degree.

I think of it this way say the majority of people with PhDs in moral philosophy conclude that corporal punishment of children is "morally acceptable" I do not think you or I would accept that conclusion without actually understanding the basis for it. We would not defer to them because they have the skills, knowledge and experience in this field and start switching our kids.

By contrast, if you are recovering from surgery in hospital and your last dose of dilaudid had worn off and you think you should double the dosage, you should defer to the physician who refuses to do so. They could explain it to you, but it might take several hours for you to understand the physiology, issues

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极速赛车168官网 By: Brian Green Adams https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46296 Sat, 01 Mar 2014 15:04:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46296 In reply to David Nickol.

These are credentials in a field of study, but I think this is simply not a field of study in which we ever need to defer to authority.

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极速赛车168官网 By: Brian Green Adams https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46295 Sat, 01 Mar 2014 14:59:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46295 In reply to Brandon Vogt.

Brandon, this was an example, I was not trying to prove a point about cosmology. I will accept what the majority of well-respected physicists and cosmologists say about it, because it is beyond my skill and education to understand it myself.

For the same reason, I think there is no such thing as expertise in morality requiring our trust in authority.

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极速赛车168官网 By: vito https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46294 Sat, 01 Mar 2014 13:44:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46294 Theologians, distinguished clerics etc. can be an authority in their field only in the sense that they can teach you what the rules in their religion are, i.e. what their particular church, sacred text, document etc teaches. For instance, I may go to a particular distinguished Catholic theologian for an explanation of the concept of Holy trinity. He would explain and I would believe that that's WHAT THE CHURCH IS TEACHING. In that sense, he is an authority. But he is definitely not an authority in the "truth' aspect of his claim. Why? because his claims are untestable. So yes, people with high degrees in theology may know what the claims ARE, but not if they are true.

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极速赛车168官网 By: Sqrat https://strangenotions.com/arguing-from-authority/#comment-46291 Sat, 01 Mar 2014 12:17:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=4030#comment-46291 In reply to Raphael.

Having a free will allows you to express a disagreement, regardless of whether you agree or disagree. I don't see how it would allow you to disagree if you actually agreed. But, as a thought experiment, could you, as an act of will, choose to agree with him right now, just like that?

Go ahead -- agree with him for a few days. Be utterly convinced that he's dead-on right. Give it a try and let us all know the results.

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