极速赛车168官网 Comments on: Pope Benedict on the “Dark Passages” of Scripture https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/ A Digital Areopagus // Reason. Faith. Dialogue. Wed, 13 Nov 2013 02:44:00 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.7.1 极速赛车168官网 By: Susan https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35881 Wed, 13 Nov 2013 02:44:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35881 In reply to Kevin Aldrich.

Hi Kevin,
If you're really interested in the subject, I suggest you look into what the people in the field have to say on the subject.
Spitzer is cherry picking in order to make a point, conflating our intuitive notions of "beginning" with the ways in which cosmologists use it. that he fails to make anyway

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极速赛车168官网 By: Susan https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35854 Tue, 12 Nov 2013 08:20:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35854 In reply to Steven Dillon.

Because we're trying to compare mutually exclusive hypotheses to determine which is a better explanation of some set of phenomena

No need to mislabel, then. You could simply state the two hypotheses.
A) Consciousness is more probable (therefore, better explained) by a deity, the attributes of which, will be specifically laid out for the purposes of testing this hypothesis.
and
B)

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极速赛车168官网 By: Steven Dillon https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35790 Mon, 11 Nov 2013 13:56:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35790 In reply to Susan.

How about we call the position that a god exists theism and not believing that any gods exist atheism?

Because we're trying to compare mutually exclusive hypotheses to determine which is a better explanation of some set of phenomena. The positions that a god exists and of not believing in any gods are not mutually exclusive: one concerns the existence of gods, the other lack of belief in them.

Only to the extent that it asserts that an incoherent, unevidenced conscious being exists. Not very impressive. I can assert all kinds of things.

You make a lot of question-begging claims such as that there is no evidence for any of these gods, or that God is incoherent.

In any case, you don't seem to understand how we determine whether something counts as evidence for a hypothesis. Check out my citation of Pruss again, there's a reason why it matters that God's existence would require there to be consciousness while God's non-existence would not.

As far as defining consciousness, if you're not sure what consciousness is, perhaps a discussion on whether or not God exists should come later.

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极速赛车168官网 By: Kevin Aldrich https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35788 Mon, 11 Nov 2013 13:11:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35788 In reply to Susan.

Spitzer writes:

There are three pieces of evidence arising out of space-time geometry proofs which indicate a beginning of our universe or any speculative multiverse in which our universe might be situated. It also indicates a beginning of oscillating universes – even oscillating universes in higher dimensional space. These proofs are so widely applicable that they establish a beginning of virtually every hypothetical pre-big bang condition which can be connected to our universe. They, therefore, indicate the probability of an absolute beginning of physical reality which implies the probability of a Creator outside of our universe (or any multiverse in which it might be situated).

An absolute beginning means before which there was no physical reality of any kind.

http://magisgodwiki.org/index.php?title=Cosmology#Evidence_of_a_Beginning_from_Space-Time_Geometry_Proofs

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极速赛车168官网 By: Susan https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35781 Mon, 11 Nov 2013 04:30:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35781 In reply to Kevin Aldrich.

What do you mean by absolute beginning?

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极速赛车168官网 By: Kevin Aldrich https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35779 Mon, 11 Nov 2013 03:06:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35779 In reply to Susan.

I wrote this above and you haven't responded:

In his argument here:

http://magisgodwiki.org/index....

Spitzer provides evidence from contemporary physics that in every inflationary universe, there must be an absolute beginning.

Is that what you mean by not new or good?

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极速赛车168官网 By: Susan https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35776 Mon, 11 Nov 2013 02:30:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35776 In reply to Steven Dillon.

Let's stipulatively call the position that God exists 'theism' and the position that God does not exist 'atheism'.

How about we call the position that a god exists theism and the position that the existence of a god is unjustified atheism?

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极速赛车168官网 By: Susan https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35775 Mon, 11 Nov 2013 02:23:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35775 In reply to Kevin Aldrich.

No. It is an inductive argument.

And neither a new one nor a good one.

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极速赛车168官网 By: Kevin Aldrich https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35774 Mon, 11 Nov 2013 02:20:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35774 In reply to Susan.

A B argument will be a philosophical argument. It will use both arguments drawn from physics and deductive arguments to reach a conclusion.

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极速赛车168官网 By: Susan https://strangenotions.com/pope-benedict-on-the-dark-passages-of-scripture/#comment-35773 Mon, 11 Nov 2013 02:12:00 +0000 http://strangenotions.com/?p=3795#comment-35773 In reply to Kevin Aldrich.

Right now we are considering a B argument

Yes. We are. Which is why I'm confused about you suggesting a valid argument is evidence for anything. "Valid argument" is short for "deductively valid".

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